Email: Help with Guard List

Hey Aki,

I thought you would be the best person for this job...

one of our members wants to get a list ready for an upcoming tournament.... and I was wondering if you would take a few moments to review it...

it looks like this..

Company command squad – 70 points

4 snipers in command squad

Vet Squad – 80 points – melta gun

Vet squad – 70 points

Vet Squad – 70 points

Vendetta gunship x2 – 260 points

Valkyrie – 100 points

Battle tanks x 3 – 510 points

Heavy bolter sponsons

Leman russ punisher x1 – 210 points

Multi melta sponsons

Leman russ punisher x1 – 250 points

Commander Pask

Heavy Bolter Sponsons

Leman russ executioner – 230 points

Plasma cannon sponsons

Total Points – 1850

Now I will admit that I know NOTHING about the IG codex and what potential they have, that's why I am deferring to you. someone who has recently participated in a tourney and knows alot about the codex and hopefully.. someone who loves helping those underlings put together some decent list and tactics..

Anyways, anything you could help with would be greatly appreciated.

thanks again man!!!

Wow. Looks like someone likes tanks more than I do.

Always a pleasure to help out. But first I've got to give my standard caveat: everybody needs experience with their army to determine what works best for them. This is especially true with Imperial Guard because there are sooooo many different ways to make a list. So much of list design depends on your own play style. 

With that said, here are my comments and suggestions. I tried to keep the overall theme of your list.

The first HUGE problem is the lack of troops. It looks like the plan is to bring the troops in air-cav style, but if I were playing this list in an objective based game (which, you have to consider, three, possible four, of the games will be objective based), I would simply kill all your troops at all costs. Sure, I may lose a lot, but you are guaranteed to lose without anybody to take objectives.

You really need at least four troop choices.

The second problem is the command squad is a point sink in an all mech list. Snipers are fun, but not extremely effective. Yes, the order from the commander will help, but you’re going to have a “naked” (unarmored) squad hiding in the bushes with nobody by snipers to take the wounds you’ll get. It’s a fun unit to play, but in a tournament it will simple be squashed unless there are more appealing targets around it.

When playing all mech (or air/mech, as in this list), the HQ choice is a hindrance. I usually field a Primaris Pskyer. He’s got a power weapon , the 2D6 S6 electric-out-of-the-fingers attacks and, most important, he’s the cheapest HQ choice. Attach him to a vet squad and you’re good to go.

The true value of a command squad is when you field an infantry platoon. But more on that later.

I am assuming six tanks are arranged like this:

1 squadron of two Leman Russ Battle Tanks

1 squadron of two Punishers (1 with Pask)

1 Executioner

You really need to look at and appreciate wound allocations on squadrons. Once the tanks are hit with a close combat squad, they will be quickly destroyed. And trust me, there is a lot out there that will get into close combat with your tanks quickly.

But the purposes of your tanks seem skewed. The Battle Tanks have the cannon, hull HB, and sponson HB. It looks like they are set up for anti-infantry, but you’ve already got that covered with the Punishers.

One of the Punishers has mulit-meltas, but the Punisher cannon is an anti-infantry gun.

Pask will allow you to hit more with the Punisher cannon, but 50 points to add 1 to the BS isn’t worth it unless you have Vanquisher.

The plasma Executioner is loads of fun, but it is heavy anti-infantry (a terminator killer).

Here’s the low-down on tanks:

Leman Russ Battle Tank – all around multi-purpose beast that should be geared towards anti-armor. ALWAYS include the hull lascannon. You can move 6” and still shoot the lascannon and battle cannon. Remember to always move when infantry get close to prevent the auto-hit on the assault, so you won’t get a chance to use the sponson HB very often.

Leman Russ Punisher – loads of fun, but really doesn’t kill as much as you would think. I brought two to a tournament once and was disappointed. The fun thing about it is that most opponents are so scared of it that they sink everything into it, allowing the rest of your army to do what you want.

You won’t face that type of opponent in a tournament.

Executioner is expense, but loads of fun in a game. If you stand still, you will get five plasma templates dropping on someone’s head. If you have the points, it’s worth it.

Demolisher is a wonderful close-range beast that will attract a lot of attention. It is one of the ultimate “deal with me or die” units. Lascannon on the hull is a requirement as its purpose is to kill the enemy vehicles that jump out in the front and any infantry that doesn’t appreciate the power of the pie plate. Sponson multi-meltas are a nice touch, but that makes for a very expensive target.

The main issues with this list are not enough troops and the tanks are geared for too many purposes to be effective.

So, here is what I would suggest while trying to keep as much of this that you currently have:

Company Command Squad w/ 4 snipers (70)

Vet Squad w/ meltagun (80)

Vet Squad (70)

Vet Squad (70)

Infantry Platoon

----Platoon Command Squad (30)

----Infantry Squad (50)

----Infantry Squad (50)

----Heavy Weapon Squad w/Missile Launchers (90)

----Heavy Weapon Squad w/Missile Launchers (90)

Valkyrie (100)

Valkyrie (100)

Valkyrie (100)

Tank Squadron

----Leman Russ Punisher w/ sponson HB (190)

----Leman Russ Punisher w/ sponson HB (190)

Leman Russ Demolisher w/sponson MM and hull Lascannon and Dozer (220)

Leman Russ Demolisher w/sponson MM and hull Lascannon and Dozer (220)

Here’s the idea…

The three vet squads go into the valks and are held in reserve. What you want to do is hope they come in as late as possible. When they come in, keep moving them 18” to gain the 4+ cover save. At the last moment, take and contest the objectives.

The infantry platoon sits in the back behind the tanks. Their job is to claim the back objectives. If you are fighting an army that has a bunch of deep striking units, spread them out to the max to try to cause the deep strike mishaps.

The missile launcher squads are spread out (and hopefully elevated) with the company command squad in between them. Make sure you spread them out and into cover to a) ensure they both have good fields of fire and b) to prevent them all from being taken out in a single blast.

The company commander keeps issuing Bring it Down commands, one to each missile launcher squad. There is nothing more effective than 6 twin-linked missile launchers when it comes to taking out vehicles. The snipers are just for fun. MAKE SURE YOU ISSUE YOUR ORDERS AT THE RIGHT TIME. You need to issue them before shooting anything else. So the missile launchers will be shooting at the beginning of the shooting phase.

The Punishers sit front and center. You will have 58 S5 shots into a single squad if you don’t move and shoot everything. That should beat the averages for the terminator squads and be a real crowd pleaser against hordes.

The Demolishers are separate units (not in a squad). You need to get them forward and kill any AV14 you have. ALWAYS fire the S10 cannon and one other weapon. Get within 12” and you’re in optimal melta range, outside of 12” shoot the lascannon with the cannon. You need the dozers on these puppies so you don’t need to worry about terrain. Nothing sucks more than a short range cannon that gets stuck in the mud.

This gives you 130 points to add extras to your squads (maybe even add another infantry squad or two). You need to really consider bringing Marbo (65 points). You will not find another unit in the entire game that makes up twice (or more) of their value as consistently as Marbo. Just remember, when he comes in, put him somewhere to throw his demo charge on a unit that is NOT in cover, otherwise you just wasted it. Yes, he will die EVERY GAME, but he is worth it.

I purposely changed the Vendettas to Valks to save points. Remember, the purpose of the valks is to keep moving really fast and take objectives on the last turn. Moving around at 18” means you ain’t shooting much, so give the guns to someone else. You may want to add more melta to the vet squads – they can hold 3 each and have an awesome BS4. Popping a 3 melta vet squad out of a valk that just ran 12” up behind a tank is means your opponent has a dead tank.

So, there it is. That’s how I would build and play this type of list. It may mean building more infantry models, but you’ll need it in order to ensure you have enough scoring units.

Good luck!